Re: List intolerance VS advocacy

[Tom Monte <tom@creditex.com>]

Great post, Scott. I completely agree.  This kind of attitude is why I left
the cisco groupstudy list.

-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Sandeman-Allen (RSCorp) [mailto:scott@rscorp.ab.ca]
Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2002 6:15 AM
To: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: List intolerance VS advocacy


Hello fellow list members.

I am disturbed by some of the 'negative' comments on this list even though
they
are not directed at me. This is not because I "can't take it" or that I'm a
"sensitive new-age guy" but because of the damage that it does.

While I agree that many newbies don't thoroughly read the manual(s) I am
enlightened enough to know that not everyone knows how to research nor do
they
learn in the same manner. It is also a fact that many people have trouble
learning from the printed word let alone transpose that into their
situation.
While the documentation is decent it certainly does not hand-hold the new
kid on
the block so to speak. More could be said, you get the idea.

Another fact to keep in mind is that many users/newbies come from different
environments and don't 'think' like *nix let alone BSD. MCBS,YGTI

It is detrimental to everyone if we discourage people from asking questions
and
when we offend users of any experience level. Think of it this way, in a
hypothetical example: 

    John B. or Jane Q. Newbie is looking for an alternative OS 
    for personal use. They find out about a cool project called 
    OpenBSD and investigate it. Then, months later, they are in 
    a board meeting when it is discussed that their server got 
    hacked or some other IT related problem where OBSD would fit.

How do they respond in this situation? 

If they had a good experience using OBSD they could say "Why not use
OpenBSD..."
Then, as a community, we would have just won. I don't believe any
illustrations
are necessary for what a bad experience would do in that board room or _any_
other place the 'flamed' person may venture.

So. What _IS_ the purpose of this, or any OBSD list? Trust me, it is not
"just"
about the primary topic. And don't believe that "little harm is done because
messages disappear off the list" either - remember many newbies are pointed
directly to the archives for assistance!

There is now a 'newbies' list and people should be encouraged to ask their
entry-level questions there (it should be listed on the official site BTW).
They
should be encouraged to RTFM and most importantly, they should be encouraged
to
continue using a great OS.

Many on this and other OBSD lists are very good at directing people at a
good
starting point. My compliments to them for their patience and tolerance
(especially with my questions ;-). 

OBSD is a great project, the developers deserve huge kudos for a job well
done.
The best way we can show our appreciation is by making the community just as
good so that users come and stay... and encourage others to do so as well.

Thanks for your time,

Scott

______________________________________________
Scott Sandeman-Allen
Roderick Scott Corporation
Edmonton, Alberta. Canada

"Its not that we're much better, its just that we're less worse"
                        - The Arrogant Worms


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