Re: Are the FSF helpful?

[Nick Holland <nick@holland-consulting.net>]

Ciaran O'Riordan wrote:
...
> While reading the OpenBSD docs I was surprised that GNU/Linux
> is referred to as "Linux".
> 
> The OpenBSD community are quite a technical group, it is obviously
> known that Linux is a kernel, not an OS.  So what reason is there for
> choosing "Linux" over "GNU" or "GNU/Linux".
> 
> The name "Linux" is used constantly by proprietary software companies.

It is also used by press, media, and almost everyone other than some
FSF fanatics.

> It allows them to ignore the issues of Freedom and openness thus
> encouraging people to run (and trust) the binary software packages
> they distribute.

Sorry, you have a lot of work to do to convince me of your logic.  In
virtually everyone's mind I've met, Linux is free software...

> Users and developers in the general Free Software community can make
> their own decisions as to what name they want to use.  Why not band
> together to help eachother?

We seem to have a very different definition of "free".  

Your definition of "free" includes a multi-page legal document filled,
almost 18k in plain text, the meaning of which is debated endlessly by
people.

As you have chosen to define "free" as you wish (does capitalizing it
let you do that?), I will define "Linux" as I wish.  For me, "Linux"
means:
   "The operating system consisting of a kernel originally created 
   by Linus Torvalds surrounded by numerous applications and 
   utilities, packaged by many major and hundreds of minor 
   distributors.  People participating in this are too numerous to 
   mention, but include code from BSD, FSF, and thousands of people
   and groups around the world of varying affiliations", 
but that's too long to type everywhere.  So, we call it Linux.  You
call it GNU/Linux.  Whatever.  Someone else could call it Bob.  Ooops,
no, that name was already used.

Oh, btw.  As I recall, there are bits of BSD code in GNU
software...so, shouldn't you call it BSD/GNU/Linux?

> The GNU project has created many good pieces of software that are used
> by OpenBSD people. (GCC, GDB, binutils, wget, textutils, gnupg,
> gnuchess, fileutils, emacs, bash, automake, autoconf, etc.)  The
> campaigning the Free Software Foundations does against anti-programmer
> laws also aids the Free Software community as a whole.

Don't start me.
 
> Calling the system "GNU" or "GNU/Linux" is not only more accurate but
> also raises awareness about the GNU project.  This helps attract
> developers which benefits all Free Software OSs.

And next what?  A link to the GPL and FSF web site?  Your Freedom to
dictate other people's freedom?  Your freedom to dictate our
advertising for your politics?
 
> This is not an all-or-nothing issue, it's the-more-the-merrier.  Even
> if a quarter (or even one) of the OpenBSD community used the term
> "GNU" or "GNU/Linux", it would be helpful.  OpenBSD developers owe the
> FSF nothing, that's what sharing is about, many GNU/Linux users use
> openssh etc. (thanks).

How about seeing if you can get a non-trivial percentage of the Linux
community to call themselves "GNU/Linux" first, before pushing this
kind of stuff on people who Really Don't Care.  

I know a lot of people using lots of operating systems.  I think I
have heard precisely two people refer to Linux as "GNU/Linux".  One of
them, a relatively new user, said, "Did you know that there are some
people who say Linux should be said, written and pronounced,
'GNU/Linux'?" as if it were the most wacked out thing in the world,
the other said "GNU" with a snide tone in his voice.  These were Linux
users, not *BSD users, neither of them even recognized the meaning of
the OpenBSD T-shirt I was probably wearing.

Whereas, I know Linux users who were using it almost from day one,
when it was installed from floppy disks.  People who live, eat and
breath it.  And NONE of them refer to it as "GNU/Linux".

You have a loooooonnnnnnnggggg way to go before you come preaching to
us.  Work over your choir, first.  Until Linux users start saying "I'm
using GNU/Linux" to me, what you are requesting of us is just plain
silly.  OpenBSD does not wish to be a marketing arm for what appears
to be just a small fringe of the FSF that appears to forget SOFTWARE
is the product, not names.  

A lot of people associated with free software (note the lower case
letters, but I do include people with the FSF in this) are doing very
good, very important work.  People wishing to change the popular name
of a popular piece of software just give those doing real work a bad
name.

> Any thoughts?

Yes.
The point at which you tell us how to reference Linux in our
documentation is the point at which I expect a note from Theo saying,
"Nick, remove every reference to that operating system" (he won't
phrase it like that, however), and if he doesn't say that to me, I'll
ask him.

May I suggest you devote your time to auditing your own code base,
improving your product, rather than getting wrapped up in petty little
issues like names.  I don't care what people call me, as long as it is
said with respect that I have earned.  I'd suggest that philosophy be
adopted by the FSF.

Or, put concisely: "Shut up and hack"

Nick.
-- 
http://www.holland-consulting.net