From: owner-ceremony-digest@monkey.org (ceremony-digest) To: ceremony-digest@monkey.org Subject: ceremony-digest V2003 #46 Reply-To: ceremony@monkey.org Sender: owner-ceremony-digest@monkey.org Errors-To: owner-ceremony-digest@monkey.org Precedence: bulk ------- + Ceremony list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ + See the above site for subscribing/unsubscribing and back issues. ------- ceremony-digest Wednesday, September 3 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 046 (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD Re: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD RE: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 Re: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 (Fac33) Drop me an email Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD (Fac33) Slow Jam Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam (Fac33) Manchester Re: (Fac33) Manchester Re: (Fac33) Manchester RE: (Fac33) Manchester (Fac33) 808 State RE: (Fac33) 808 State (Fac33) Peter Saville Sept 2 Re: (Fac33) Manchester Re: (Fac33) Manchester Re: (Fac33) Manchester Re: (Fac33) 808 State (Fac33) Slam vs New Order Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 11:49:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Eddie Colton Subject: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 God, this is so pathetic. David Bowie has a new album out next month, only 15 months after his last album. And New Order, who would do well to get their stale music out to stores before it's completely out of fashion, is not even popular on its own mailing list. By the time they put out a new record, people won't even remember what a record is. We'll have two-inch silver discs like in Men in Black. "Hey, we finally made an all-out rock album!" they'll say. "But rock n' roll was outlawed when the Martians took over," the world will reply. "Huh? What? Martians?" WAKE UP, NEW ORDER. Being old is no excuse. Bowie's practically a corpse. Being English, boring, or parents are all non-issues as well. Get out of the music business if you don't like making music, you lazy bastards. We don't have New Order tattoos because we think Barney is so cool lounging on his porch with a beer sitting on his gut. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 11:54:25 -0700 (PDT) From: "Andrew J. Lillie" Subject: Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD Wow, better than Elegia??? I don't think I'd go that far. It's certainly a nice track, to be sure. But, I really don't think it carries anywhere near the kind of emotional power (for lack of a better description) that Elegia does. If the question is whether or not you should buy it, then I can answer an emphatic yes. But, with all due respect to Mick, don't expect it to be the best instrumental you've heard from the band (which, to maybe give you some indication where I'm coming, from would have to be the original Salvation soundtrack version of "Let's Go"). - -=3DA=3D- On Wed, 27 Aug 2003, Mick Aneworderfan wrote: > >Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 13:04:49 +0100 > >From: daniel.butt@keble.ox.ac.uk > >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD > > > >Has anyone got the soundtrack CD to the Peter > >Saville exhibition yet? What's it like? Do we know if > >they're definitely in stock at the exhibition? I think I'm > >going on Friday. > > *Sorry for the late reply... been very busy, you know... it's absolutely > excellent, much much better than Elegia and Avalanche, it's the first tru= ly > wonderful instrumental track New Order have ever made. They must be proud > they have done a job at the level of Brian Eno, the instrumentation is > wonderful, the melody is fabulous, I like the way it flows, it's really > relaxing and yet emotional... it's perfect as the soundtrack for a show, > especially Saville's, it's generally perfect as background music. > Of course you can't listen to the whole half hour every time as with a fo= ur > minutes pop song (I mean paying the same attention), but you hardly get > tired of having it as background atmosphere... just try while you're at y= our > computer, or while driving (if not sleepy, if sleepy you better play stuf= f > like Fine Time...). It's just perfect for what it's made for. > > mick: mick973@email.it > aneworderfan blog: http://aneworderfan.blogspot.com > > > > -- > Email.it, the professional e-mail, gratis per te: http://www.email.it/f > > Sponsor: > Interessi alti, massima libert=E0. =C8 Conto Arancio di ING Direct. > Clicca qui: http://adv.email.it/cgi-bin/foclick.cgi?mid=3D660&d=3D27-8 > ------- > + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > + To talk to a person, send mail to . > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 14:56:26 -0400 From: "Neil" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eddie Colton" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 2:49 PM Subject: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 >We don't have New Order tattoos > because we think Barney is so cool lounging on his porch with a beer > sitting on his gut. > We have New Order tattoos? ;-o Neil. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 14:58:03 -0400 From: "Neil" Subject: Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mick Aneworderfan" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 2:41 PM Subject: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD > >Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 13:04:49 +0100 > >From: daniel.butt@keble.ox.ac.uk > >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD > > > >Has anyone got the soundtrack CD to the Peter > >Saville exhibition yet? What's it like? Do we know if > >they're definitely in stock at the exhibition? I think I'm > >going on Friday. > > Of course you can't listen to the whole half hour every time as with a four > minutes pop song (I mean paying the same attention), but you hardly get > tired of having it as background atmosphere... I play my mp3 copy using WinAmp with loop and x-fade enabled so it sounds like the track never ends. Neil. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 15:06:47 -0400 From: "Brian Cameron" Subject: Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD Just for everyone's information... it was pointed out some time ago that you can order the CD from the exhibition store and that it is not necessary to visit the exhibition. I ordered mine a couple months back and it appeared in my mail in about a week. Sorry, I don't have the mailing address handy, but if anyone is interested I will track it down. Bri > > >Has anyone got the soundtrack CD to the Peter > > >Saville exhibition yet? What's it like? Do we know if > > >they're definitely in stock at the exhibition? I think I'm > > >going on Friday. > > > > > Of course you can't listen to the whole half hour every time as with a > four > > minutes pop song (I mean paying the same attention), but you hardly get > > tired of having it as background atmosphere... > > > I play my mp3 copy using WinAmp with loop and x-fade enabled so it sounds > like the track never ends. > > Neil. > ------- > + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > + To talk to a person, send mail to . > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 20:14:21 +0100 From: Brian McGee Subject: RE: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 > -----Original Message----- > From: Eddie Colton [mailto:bratpop@yahoo.com] > Sent: 27 August 2003 19:49 > To: ceremony@monkey.org > Subject: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 > > > God, this is so pathetic. David Bowie has a new album out next month, > only 15 months after his last album. And New Order, who would do well > to get their stale music out to stores before it's completely out of > fashion, is not even popular on its own mailing list. And Kraftwerk... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2003 12:19:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Mark Dignam Subject: Re: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 - --- Neil wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eddie Colton" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 2:49 PM > Subject: (Fac33) Re: ceremony-digest V2003 #45 > > > > >We don't have New Order tattoos > > because we think Barney is so cool lounging on his > porch with a beer > > sitting on his gut. > > > > We have New Order tattoos? ;-o > > Neil. I thought we all had to have one for entry to the list... I have "Power, Corruption & Lies" on my penis. No, really... it was pretty painful - I was going to stop after "POW" but thought that was a bit boastful. AtB Mark ramsesblue@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 02:40:06 -0300 From: almanso Subject: (Fac33) Drop me an email sorry to all the members of the list. this message is to one person. i want to talk to a guy that offered to send me a CD a couple of months ago. but i never received it and i lost his email. so if you are this person, please drop me an email. i want to know what happened.... thanks! and sorry again! alejo ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 17:40:03 +0930 From: "Brad Edwards" Subject: Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD Despite the risk I took in sending my CC details by email (what was I thinking??) they were AMAZINGLY fast. Less than a week from Manchester to Adelaide. Sweet! Brad - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Cameron" To: Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 4:36 AM Subject: Re: >Subject: (Fac33) Saville CD > Just for everyone's information... it was pointed out some time ago that you > can order the CD from the exhibition store and that it is not necessary to > visit the exhibition. I ordered mine a couple months back and it appeared > in my mail in about a week. Sorry, I don't have the mailing address handy, > but if anyone is interested I will track it down. > > Bri > > > > >Has anyone got the soundtrack CD to the Peter > > > >Saville exhibition yet? What's it like? Do we know if > > > >they're definitely in stock at the exhibition? I think I'm > > > >going on Friday. > > > > > > > > Of course you can't listen to the whole half hour every time as with a > > four > > > minutes pop song (I mean paying the same attention), but you hardly get > > > tired of having it as background atmosphere... > > > > > > I play my mp3 copy using WinAmp with loop and x-fade enabled so it sounds > > like the track never ends. > > > > Neil. > > ------- > > + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > > + To talk to a person, send mail to . > > > > ------- > + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > + To talk to a person, send mail to . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 20:02:53 +0100 From: Brian McGee Subject: (Fac33) Slow Jam Isn't Slow Jam just the best song of all time, by anyone, ever? Currently on my headphones.. Sorry, just had to say that. Brian ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:36:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeremy Herskowitz Subject: Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam Finally I bought the Revenge albums. I was not impressed. Does anyone really like these records? I just felt that there was very little melody in any of the songs. On that note, I was pumped as hell for Twisted Tenderness to come out. But when it did, I thought it was crap too...except for the title track and "make it happen". Do other people feel the same way? Jeremy __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 12:52:53 -0700 (PDT) From: "Andrew J. Lillie" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam I actually like both "One True Passion" and "Gun World Porn". The former has some fascinating really dense production and a couple really great songs (Seven Reasons / Pineapple Face), though I grant you it doesn't have a lot of memorable melodies. The latter has Deadbeat (I'm talking about the original version of the track which is on the US version of "GWP"), and that's all I need to say. Interestingly, I think the best Revenge tracks are actually non album tracks, namely Jesus I Love You, Love You Too (remix of JILY), and 14K. I share your disdain for "TT" though. I haven't even bothered to buy it, because I listened to it on a listening station and just was completely disinterested, except maybe Prodigal Son. - -=A=- On Thu, 28 Aug 2003, Jeremy Herskowitz wrote: > Finally I bought the Revenge albums. I was not > impressed. Does anyone really like these records? I > just felt that there was very little melody in any of > the songs. > > On that note, I was pumped as hell for Twisted > Tenderness to come out. But when it did, I thought it > was crap too...except for the title track and "make it > happen". Do other people feel the same way? > > Jeremy > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com > ------- > + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > + To talk to a person, send mail to . > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 16:55:23 -0300 From: almanso Subject: Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam > Finally I bought the Revenge albums. I was not > impressed. Does anyone really like these records? I > just felt that there was very little melody in any of > the songs. i like revenge. for me it=B4s the second best related band, after electronic. for me it has all hooky=B4s power. somehow he lost it on monaco where everything sound too light. besides pinapple face, slave, bleachman, big bang, fag hag and state of shock are great songs. i think the only problem is the melody but that=B4s because Hooky inspite of having a nice voice doesn=B4t know much about how to use it. he always sings the same way. even o= n monaco. > On that note, I was pumped as hell for Twisted > Tenderness to come out. But when it did, I thought it > was crap too...except for the title track and "make it > happen". Do other people feel the same way? hahaha, disagree again. TT is the best electronic album and so the best related band album in my opinion. it just blowed my mind. i remember at tha= t time i wanted them to return to the guitar sound because i was very disappointed with Raise The Pressure=B4s sound, too synthetic for my taste. but i never thought they would do it! and they did it! so i was very happy with it. in fact i think Get Ready couldn=B4t sound like it sounds without Barney getting through the Twisted Tenderness process. for me Get Ready is just another step forward from TT with Hooky=B4s bass. my 2 cents alejo ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 13:02:53 -0700 (PDT) From: "Andrew J. Lillie" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam On Thu, 28 Aug 2003, almanso wrote: > hahaha, disagree again. TT is the best electronic album and so the best > related band album in my opinion. it just blowed my mind. i remember at t= hat > time i wanted them to return to the guitar sound because i was very > disappointed with Raise The Pressure=B4s sound, too synthetic for my tast= e. > but i never thought they would do it! and they did it! so i was very happ= y > with it. in fact i think Get Ready couldn=B4t sound like it sounds withou= t > Barney getting through the Twisted Tenderness process. for me Get Ready i= s > just another step forward from TT with Hooky=B4s bass. Interesting that you would say that. I completely agree about Get Ready sounding like TT in places. And, that's one of the reasons Get Ready doesn't do much for me. It very much sounds like Electronic just with Hooky-parts in place of the more complicated J Marr guitar parts. - -=3DA=3D- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 13:46:42 -0700 From: Sam Habash Subject: Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam On Thu, Aug 28, 2003 at 12:36:38PM -0700, Jeremy Herskowitz wrote: > Finally I bought the Revenge albums. I was not > impressed. Does anyone really like these records? I > just felt that there was very little melody in any of > the songs. I think that might be because Hooky intentionally sought to supress his melodic bass playing, but all Revenge output is seriously underrated. The only weakness is really Hooky's lyrics, but that's the same sort of thing one can say about Barney. Has anybody mentioned "It's Quiet". That's a killer tune, very Go-Betweens (or so they say) > On that note, I was pumped as hell for Twisted > Tenderness to come out. But when it did, I thought it > was crap too...except for the title track and "make it > happen". Do other people feel the same way? I haven't really related to it that much...so I need to imbibe the songs again...but yeah, I don't have the same emotional attachment with post-'Electronic' Electronic that I do with any Revenge/Monaco/OT material... - --Sam - --------------------------------------------------------------------- "Of course, there are limits to diversity, earth is a single point of failure for the foreseeable future." -- Sean Donelan - --------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 16:57:53 -0400 From: "Bri" Subject: (Fac33) Manchester The first time I stepped onto English soil was in Manchester. Albeit, the Manchester airport. From there, my best friend and I hitch-hiked away from the city -- never to return. That was 34 years ago. On Tuesday I will be returning to England for the 9th time. This time I will be flying into Manchester. I plan to spend several days in the city on both ends of the trip. I'm open to suggestions on what to see in the city that is home to my fave group: NewOrder. Bri ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 17:02:05 -0400 From: "Bri" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Manchester Oh, and don't say: "Strangeways Brewery -- brewers of Boddingtons Ale" :^) Bri > The first time I stepped onto English soil was in Manchester. Albeit, the > Manchester airport. From there, my best friend and I hitch-hiked away from > the city -- never to return. That was 34 years ago. On Tuesday I will be > returning to England for the 9th time. This time I will be flying into > Manchester. I plan to spend several days in the city on both ends of the > trip. I'm open to suggestions on what to see in the city that is home to my > fave group: NewOrder. > > Bri > > ------- > + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > + To talk to a person, send mail to . > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 17:41:00 EDT From: GaoBest@aol.com Subject: Re: (Fac33) Manchester In Manchester I've enjoyed: Mcr Roadhouse (great place for bands - small "club" atmosphere) Dry Bar (Oldham Road) Night & Day (Oldham Road) various record shops within walking distance of the above places, including Vinyl Experience (I think that's the name) Factory Paradise nightclub (yes, old offices of Factory Records) I know there's more. I did go to the Granada TV Studios (Coronation Street) - - sorta like Universal Studios tour, but on a less-grand scale :-) If you go to Sankey's Soap venue, walk there but cab back afterwards - the area is VERY DODGY - don't walk there alone. Manchester Apollo is always good... x Mike In a message dated 8/28/03 2:04:43 PM, hesse@ist.uwaterloo.ca writes: << The first time I stepped onto English soil was in Manchester. Albeit, the Manchester airport. From there, my best friend and I hitch-hiked away from the city -- never to return. That was 34 years ago. On Tuesday I will be returning to England for the 9th time. This time I will be flying into Manchester. I plan to spend several days in the city on both ends of the trip. I'm open to suggestions on what to see in the city that is home to my fave group: NewOrder. >> ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2003 09:31:41 +0100 From: "John Gardner" Subject: RE: (Fac33) Manchester Museum of Science and technology is excellent. Includes a section called 'The making of Manchester (free admission). Salford Quays is also worth a trip, only a short distance away. JG - -----Original Message----- From: owner-ceremony@monkey.org [mailto:owner-ceremony@monkey.org] On Behalf Of Bri Sent: 28 August 2003 21:58 To: ceremony@monkey.org Subject: (Fac33) Manchester The first time I stepped onto English soil was in Manchester. Albeit, the Manchester airport. From there, my best friend and I hitch-hiked away from the city -- never to return. That was 34 years ago. On Tuesday I will be returning to England for the 9th time. This time I will be flying into Manchester. I plan to spend several days in the city on both ends of the trip. I'm open to suggestions on what to see in the city that is home to my fave group: NewOrder. Bri - ------- + Ceremony mailing list web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ + To talk to a person, send mail to . ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2003 10:10:31 -0300 From: "Peter Zarustica, the King of Prussia" Subject: (Fac33) 808 State I listened to both tracks (BM and Confusion) and they are AMAZING. They have that old skool 88 vibe we love and they are absolutely fuckin funky. 808 State are always surprising me and they rock the world. I wish there was a remix of Spanish Heart. Pete ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2003 15:47:58 +0100 From: Brian McGee Subject: RE: (Fac33) 808 State Did 808 state cover these tracks? > -----Original Message----- > From: Peter Zarustica, the King of Prussia > [mailto:ceremony_neworder@hotmail.com] > Sent: 29 August 2003 14:11 > To: Ceremony > Subject: (Fac33) 808 State > > > I listened to both tracks (BM and Confusion) and they are > AMAZING. They have > that old skool 88 vibe we love and they are absolutely fuckin > funky. 808 > State are always surprising me and they rock the world. > > I wish there was a remix of Spanish Heart. > > Pete > ------- > + Ceremony mailing list web page: > http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ > + To talk to a person, send mail to . > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2003 09:47:54 -0700 (PDT) From: David Sultan Subject: (Fac33) Peter Saville Sept 2 I will be at the Design Museum for The Peter Saville talk Sept 2...If someone wants to meet up at the museum 6PM to chat or after. Drop me a line. ===== http://www.worldinmotion.net Joy Division/New Order/Electronic/Revenge/The Other Two and Monaco. http://www.factoryrecords.net Factory __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2003 10:19:49 -0300 From: "Peter Zarustica, the King of Prussia" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Manchester > various record shops within walking distance of the above places, including > Vinyl Experience (I think that's the name) Vinyl Exchange. Oxford Street and now they have another one in Deansgate. Across the street you´ll find Aflecks Palace - the best place for clothes and stuff. > I know there's more. I did go to the Granada TV Studios (Coronation Street) > - sorta like Universal Studios tour, but on a less-grand scale :-) They don't make tours anymore. > Manchester Apollo is always good... So is G-Mex. Plus you could visit the new Lowry, and the Imperial War Museum. If you are looking for a place to stay call Joan on (for uk +44) (0)77 11 556157 All the best Pete ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2003 00:49:45 +0100 From: "Simon" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Manchester >> various record shops within walking distance of the above places, >including >> Vinyl Experience (I think that's the name) > >Vinyl Exchange. Oxford Street and now they have another one in Deansgate. >Across the street you´ll find Aflecks Palace - the best place for clothes >and stuff. The main shop is on OLDHAM street and the other is Bridge Street (whch is close to Deansgate). I'm not saying that just to be pedantic, if you ask someone for directions to Oxford Street, they'll send you totally in the opposite direction of where you want to be! :) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2003 19:56:14 -0400 From: "Bri" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Manchester WOW! Just realized that Mr Hook and Mr Baker are DJing when we're there. Bri ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2003 21:44:59 -0300 From: "Peter Zarustica, the King of Prussia" Subject: Re: (Fac33) 808 State > Did 808 state cover these tracks? Not exactly. During the NewBuild sessions, 808 State (still with Gerald Simpson and Martin Price) played Blue Monday and Confusion, jammin' really. Those two tracks, plus several others not included in the album are going to be released soon. People call it "PreBuild". I don't know if it's gonna be a bootleg, I guess so. But I heard it, two weeks ago, in Manchester, and those who like old skool electronic music will love it. all the best Pete ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2003 12:17:52 +0100 From: David Sydenham Subject: (Fac33) Slam vs New Order Has anyone heard this? Is it worth forking out for or is it just another dodgy DJ cut'n'paste job? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 16:41:24 -0300 From: "Expedito Paz" Subject: Re: (Fac33) Slow Jam - ----- Original Message ----- From: "almanso" > Finally I bought the Revenge albums. I was not > impressed. Does anyone really like these records? I > just felt that there was very little melody in any of > the songs. i like revenge. for me it´s the second best related band, after electronic. for me it has all hooky´s power. somehow he lost it on monaco where everything sound too light. besides pinapple face, slave, bleachman, big bang, fag hag and state of shock are great songs. i think the only problem is the melody but that´s because Hooky inspite of having a nice voice doesn´t know much about how to use it. he always sings the same way. even on monaco. - -- I Like Revenge too. But sometimes things don´t run better on that songs. Monaco is, by far, better produced, better writter and even better sung (even by Hooky) than Revenge. > On that note, I was pumped as hell for Twisted > Tenderness to come out. But when it did, I thought it > was crap too...except for the title track and "make it > happen". Do other people feel the same way? hahaha, disagree again. TT is the best electronic album and so the best related band album in my opinion. it just blowed my mind. i remember at that time i wanted them to return to the guitar sound because i was very disappointed with Raise The Pressure´s sound, too synthetic for my taste. but i never thought they would do it! and they did it! so i was very happy with it. in fact i think Get Ready couldn´t sound like it sounds without Barney getting through the Twisted Tenderness process. for me Get Ready is just another step forward from TT with Hooky´s bass. - -- Twisted Tenderness is, for me, the second best side project album, losing only to the first Electronic. On TT, I think Barney got finally maturity as songwriter. Lyrics like Vivid, Flicker and Make It Happen are some of his best works ever. And Johnny Marr is really inspired there. And I agree with Alejo when he says that Get Ready is an evolution from TT. Check the sound. Check the Bernard´s lyrics. - -- and finally, I like Raise the Pressure, but the CD is full of highs and lows... kind of irregular work. There, we can find gems like Forbidden City and For You, and songs that not deserve a "new order member" trademark like Until the End of Time or How Long. Cheers for all, Expedito. ------------------------------ End of ceremony-digest V2003 #46 ******************************** ------- + For information on subscribing/unsubscribing and the digest archives, + see the Ceremony web page: http://www.monkey.org/~laps/ceremony/ + To talk to a person, send mail to .